That band that you love to hate

[Mr Greene]

For myself rap tends to conjure up flashbacks of Liverpool FC... 

[Thumpalumpacus]

I liked Prince's music for some reason.  I liked the funkyness and complexity of it.

Prince was a genius. He somehow managed to distill James Brown, the Beatles, Sly and the Family Stone, Jimi Hendrix, New Wave, and Curtis Mayfield into his own distinct brew. Add to being a brilliant songwriter, he was one hell of a guitarist (as well as playing 27 different instruments with varying proficiency.)

I don't like most heavy metal in general but I really dislike Guns n Roses.  (Are they considered heavy metal or are they too hair-band to be heavy metal? IDK)  Whenever I hear that screechy voice I just cringe.  The line "Welcome to the jungle" to me sounds like "Wa-wa-wa-wa-wa-wa."

Yeah, Axl has got an obnoxious voice. I consider them on the borderline between hair-metal and metal. They certainly started out with very glammy roots (pun intended). They had to; that was the only way you could get gigs in SoCal in the mid-80s when they formed up. They were definitely grittier than hair-metal, singing as they did about the dark side of Hollywood on their debut rather than singing like life was one big party.

[Thumpalumpacus]

With rap as with most other genres, there's good and bad examples of it.

Gotta say, Thump. I've never heard a good example of rap that wasn't a crossover with hard rock/metal, and those are few and far between.

As with all matters of taste, "good" and "bad" are subjective. But I like some old-school Public Enemy. They didn't sample canned tracks so much as build grooves out of found-sound samples, a form of musique concrète that really underlines their message of outrage against racial injustice with an aggressive sound.

I love Snoop Dogg's flow -- he's got swing in his versifying that tickles my jazz ears, the way he plays with the beat (of his syllables and accents) while versifying against a kicking groove.

I'm not really a fan of rap-metal crossovers, but hey, if we all liked the same things there'd be no discussion to be had. This brings to mind a band I once enjoyed but really can't listen to any more: Red Hot Chili Peppers. Songs about California featuring "chikka-bow-wow-wow" as lyrics just don't do it for me. Killer rhythm section, great grooves, but the vocals and guitars in that band just leave me high and dry.

[jerry mcmasters]

I don't like most heavy metal in general but I really dislike Guns n Roses.  (Are they considered heavy metal or are they too hair-band to be heavy metal? IDK)  Whenever I hear that screechy voice I just cringe.  The line "Welcome to the jungle" to me sounds like "Wa-wa-wa-wa-wa-wa."

Yeah, Axl has got an obnoxious voice. I consider them on the borderline between hair-metal and metal. They certainly started out with very glammy roots (pun intended). They had to; that was the only way you could get gigs in SoCal in the mid-80s when they formed up. They were definitely grittier than hair-metal, singing as they did about the dark side of Hollywood on their debut rather than singing like life was one big party.

"Grittier than hair-metal" is a good description, based only on what I know.  My dislike of heavy metal and hatred of hair-metal puts them pretty much in my not-gonna-like wheelhouse, but that said I can only name maybe two or three songs of theirs, so maybe there are some gems I just don't know of.  Most of my favorite songs are songs I would never have heard if I hadn't bought the album/cassette/cd to get the "good" songs and got exposed to the alleged filler stuff.

[Thumpalumpacus]

I don't like most heavy metal in general but I really dislike Guns n Roses.  (Are they considered heavy metal or are they too hair-band to be heavy metal? IDK)  Whenever I hear that screechy voice I just cringe.  The line "Welcome to the jungle" to me sounds like "Wa-wa-wa-wa-wa-wa."

Yeah, Axl has got an obnoxious voice. I consider them on the borderline between hair-metal and metal. They certainly started out with very glammy roots (pun intended). They had to; that was the only way you could get gigs in SoCal in the mid-80s when they formed up. They were definitely grittier than hair-metal, singing as they did about the dark side of Hollywood on their debut rather than singing like life was one big party.

"Grittier than hair-metal" is a good description, based only on what I know.  My dislike of heavy metal and hatred of hair-metal puts them pretty much in my not-gonna-like wheelhouse, but that said I can only name maybe two or three songs of theirs, so maybe there are some gems I just don't know of.  Most of my favorite songs are songs I would never have heard if I hadn't bought the album/cassette/cd to get the "good" songs and got exposed to the alleged filler stuff.

GnR doesn't really have deep cuts that outshine their hits, in my opinion. There's a couple I prefer, but there's nothing earth-shaking on their first three albums that you haven't heard, I don't think.

I liked the debut when it came out, as it seemed like a bit of heavy fresh air after years of Poison/Motley Crue/Kix/etc garbage. But boy, they spun in so fast it wasn't funny. I've liked metal most of my life, but the metal I like is not the party-metal of hair schlock, nor the Dungeons & Dragons stuff of Dio or Yngwie Malmsteen -- or even early Rush, which I otherwise love. The metal I like is topical and addresses real-world issues: Sabbath, Judas Priest up to Screaming for Vengeance, that sort of stuff. No makeup, just blistering anger, ripping riffs, and driving grooves.

[jerry mcmasters]

Yeah, Axl has got an obnoxious voice. I consider them on the borderline between hair-metal and metal. They certainly started out with very glammy roots (pun intended). They had to; that was the only way you could get gigs in SoCal in the mid-80s when they formed up. They were definitely grittier than hair-metal, singing as they did about the dark side of Hollywood on their debut rather than singing like life was one big party.

"Grittier than hair-metal" is a good description, based only on what I know.  My dislike of heavy metal and hatred of hair-metal puts them pretty much in my not-gonna-like wheelhouse, but that said I can only name maybe two or three songs of theirs, so maybe there are some gems I just don't know of.  Most of my favorite songs are songs I would never have heard if I hadn't bought the album/cassette/cd to get the "good" songs and got exposed to the alleged filler stuff.

GnR doesn't really have deep cuts that outshine their hits, in my opinion. There's a couple I prefer, but there's nothing earth-shaking on their first three albums that you haven't heard, I don't think.

I liked the debut when it came out, as it seemed like a bit of heavy fresh air after years of Poison/Motley Crue/Kix/etc garbage. But boy, they spun in so fast it wasn't funny. I've liked metal most of my life, but the metal I like is not the party-metal of hair schlock, nor the Dungeons & Dragons stuff of Dio or Yngwie Malmsteen -- or even early Rush, which I otherwise love. The metal I like is topical and addresses real-world issues: Sabbath, Judas Priest up to Screaming for Vengeance, that sort of stuff. No makeup, just blistering anger, ripping riffs, and driving grooves.

I would have put GnR in the same genre/time as Poison Motley Crue etc but they all sounded about the same to me so I may not have noticed the distinction at the time.  At the time (and now) I would have described them as a more raw and honest Twisted Sister, but not by much.  Black Sabbath and Judas Priest, Motorhead, Metallica, same thing, I probably could potentially like their stuff but just somehow missed my radar at the time.  For some reason ACDC really grabbed me, I could put on their stuff now and rock out.

[Thumpalumpacus]

"Grittier than hair-metal" is a good description, based only on what I know.  My dislike of heavy metal and hatred of hair-metal puts them pretty much in my not-gonna-like wheelhouse, but that said I can only name maybe two or three songs of theirs, so maybe there are some gems I just don't know of.  Most of my favorite songs are songs I would never have heard if I hadn't bought the album/cassette/cd to get the "good" songs and got exposed to the alleged filler stuff.

GnR doesn't really have deep cuts that outshine their hits, in my opinion. There's a couple I prefer, but there's nothing earth-shaking on their first three albums that you haven't heard, I don't think.

I liked the debut when it came out, as it seemed like a bit of heavy fresh air after years of Poison/Motley Crue/Kix/etc garbage. But boy, they spun in so fast it wasn't funny. I've liked metal most of my life, but the metal I like is not the party-metal of hair schlock, nor the Dungeons & Dragons stuff of Dio or Yngwie Malmsteen -- or even early Rush, which I otherwise love. The metal I like is topical and addresses real-world issues: Sabbath, Judas Priest up to Screaming for Vengeance, that sort of stuff. No makeup, just blistering anger, ripping riffs, and driving grooves.

I would have put GnR in the same genre/time as Poison Motley Crue etc but they all sounded about the same to me so I may not have noticed the distinction at the time.  At the time (and now) I would have described them as a more raw and honest Twisted Sister, but not by much.  Black Sabbath and Judas Priest, Motorhead, Metallica, same thing, I probably could potentially like their stuff but just somehow missed my radar at the time.  For some reason ACDC really grabbed me, I could put on their stuff now and rock out.

You can't go wrong with the AccaDaccas. I don't even consider them metal, just good, meat-and-potatoes hard rock. I still jam out on a couple of their song just for some ever-lovin' fun with my guitar fuckin' cranked.

I guess because I was 1) into metal, and 2) living at the time at ground-zero of the hair-metal explosion, differentiating was for me pretty easy. I was goddamned glad grunge killed off hair-metal once and for all.

[jerry mcmasters]

GnR doesn't really have deep cuts that outshine their hits, in my opinion. There's a couple I prefer, but there's nothing earth-shaking on their first three albums that you haven't heard, I don't think.

I liked the debut when it came out, as it seemed like a bit of heavy fresh air after years of Poison/Motley Crue/Kix/etc garbage. But boy, they spun in so fast it wasn't funny. I've liked metal most of my life, but the metal I like is not the party-metal of hair schlock, nor the Dungeons & Dragons stuff of Dio or Yngwie Malmsteen -- or even early Rush, which I otherwise love. The metal I like is topical and addresses real-world issues: Sabbath, Judas Priest up to Screaming for Vengeance, that sort of stuff. No makeup, just blistering anger, ripping riffs, and driving grooves.

I would have put GnR in the same genre/time as Poison Motley Crue etc but they all sounded about the same to me so I may not have noticed the distinction at the time.  At the time (and now) I would have described them as a more raw and honest Twisted Sister, but not by much.  Black Sabbath and Judas Priest, Motorhead, Metallica, same thing, I probably could potentially like their stuff but just somehow missed my radar at the time.  For some reason ACDC really grabbed me, I could put on their stuff now and rock out.

You can't go wrong with the AccaDaccas. I don't even consider them metal, just good, meat-and-potatoes hard rock. I still jam out on a couple of their song just for some ever-lovin' fun with my guitar fuckin' cranked.

I guess because I was 1) into metal, and 2) living at the time at ground-zero of the hair-metal explosion, differentiating was for me pretty easy. I was goddamned glad grunge killed off hair-metal once and for all.

I was actually thinking of commenting on ACDC even being "metal" or not, they do just seem like good old hard rock.  Yeah I still put on grunge stuff and probably should make an effort to explore some of the more obscure bands and songs because I like the "famous" stuff so much I'm sure I would like the hidden gems.

[Thumpalumpacus]

Yeah I still put on grunge stuff and probably should make an effort to explore some of the more obscure bands and songs because I like the "famous" stuff so much I'm sure I would like the hidden gems.

I post at a guitarist's forum that's populated with middle-aged and older guitarists -- my 53 years is probably close to the median age -- and I see gripes all the time about new music sucking. It doesn't. There's great music out there, but it's much harder to find because the market has been digitized and fragmented.

I've been really working on opening my ears and looking for 'em this last year. Trust me, they're out there, for whatever style of music you like.

As I said upthread, I think there's good and bad music from all genres. I feel the same way about musical eras.

[Dānu]

"Grittier than hair-metal" is a good description, based only on what I know.  My dislike of heavy metal and hatred of hair-metal puts them pretty much in my not-gonna-like wheelhouse, but that said I can only name maybe two or three songs of theirs, so maybe there are some gems I just don't know of.  Most of my favorite songs are songs I would never have heard if I hadn't bought the album/cassette/cd to get the "good" songs and got exposed to the alleged filler stuff.

GnR doesn't really have deep cuts that outshine their hits, in my opinion. There's a couple I prefer, but there's nothing earth-shaking on their first three albums that you haven't heard, I don't think.

I liked the debut when it came out, as it seemed like a bit of heavy fresh air after years of Poison/Motley Crue/Kix/etc garbage. But boy, they spun in so fast it wasn't funny. I've liked metal most of my life, but the metal I like is not the party-metal of hair schlock, nor the Dungeons & Dragons stuff of Dio or Yngwie Malmsteen -- or even early Rush, which I otherwise love. The metal I like is topical and addresses real-world issues: Sabbath, Judas Priest up to Screaming for Vengeance, that sort of stuff. No makeup, just blistering anger, ripping riffs, and driving grooves.

I would have put GnR in the same genre/time as Poison Motley Crue etc but they all sounded about the same to me so I may not have noticed the distinction at the time.  At the time (and now) I would have described them as a more raw and honest Twisted Sister, but not by much.  Black Sabbath and Judas Priest, Motorhead, Metallica, same thing, I probably could potentially like their stuff but just somehow missed my radar at the time.  For some reason ACDC really grabbed me, I could put on their stuff now and rock out.

Both Slash and Axl Rose have talent that bands like Poison, Motley Crue, and Twisted Sister lack, to speak nothing of superior song writing.

[Chas]

Almost anything by Joan Baez.

[Gawdzilla Sama]

Almost anything by Joan Baez.

It's weird that she chose to redo "The Night They Drove Old Dixie Down."

[SYZ]

With rap as with most other genres, there's good and bad examples of it.

Offer the best example of rap...

[SYZ]

I was actually thinking of commenting on ACDC even being "metal" or not, they do just seem like good old hard rock.  Yeah I still put on grunge stuff and probably should make an effort to explore some of the more obscure bands and songs because I like the "famous" stuff so much I'm sure I would like the hidden gems.

AC/DC stuff is actually "pub rock".

[Gawdzilla Sama]

I was actually thinking of commenting on ACDC even being "metal" or not, they do just seem like good old hard rock.  Yeah I still put on grunge stuff and probably should make an effort to explore some of the more obscure bands and songs because I like the "famous" stuff so much I'm sure I would like the hidden gems.

AC/DC stuff is actually "pub rock".

And the songs themselves are pubics.

[Thumpalumpacus]

Almost anything by Joan Baez.

They found your reaction to another famous folkie, caught on film:

[jerry mcmasters]

I was actually thinking of commenting on ACDC even being "metal" or not, they do just seem like good old hard rock.  Yeah I still put on grunge stuff and probably should make an effort to explore some of the more obscure bands and songs because I like the "famous" stuff so much I'm sure I would like the hidden gems.

AC/DC stuff is actually "pub rock".

I had to google that, interesting.  Seems to fit.

[Dancefortwo]

Almost anything by Joan Baez.

If you haven't seen this movie I highly recommend it.