Jesus' Mission....

[Cavebear]

Or.... what a man "might" have wrote, and what really seems a God would.

It's "would have written", not "would have wrote". 
It's all part of being a successful troll, and looking for Truth. 
 

So, if someone wants to challenge me, and their own system of belief, or non-belief as it were... they have that chance.

I'll pass. You're yet another third rate hack troll who thinks they're capable of defending their cult.
You say you're busy. Apparently not that busy. 

Why is it these third rate hacks actually think they are up to debating this stuff ? 
They need to find a hobby they're actually good at.

He said he's a KC. LOL
https://www.ncronline.org/blogs/distinct...cal-sphere

Perhaps he would be better at solving tavern puzzles... Or dissecting frogs. Or anything other than logic.

[Free]

....for the causal layman, those lacking understanding, or even interest:

The curse of death for sin: Gen 2:17 "…but of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil you shall not eat, for in the day that you eat of it you shall surely die.” KJV


The only way to eradicate the curse: is for a man to live free from sin, and suffer death. Because; death was only meant for sinners!

How does a man live [free of sin]? Man cannot. He can only repeat it. God, in the person of Jesus can, and does live sin free. And in the process; Teaches us “The Way, 
the Truth, and the Life.” He also atones for our sins, and reconciles Himself to man, for putting sin in front of us to begin with. Much like Him saying, "I am sharing 
in your humanity, and death so I might save all from eternal damnation." And Jesus dies at OUR sentencing and hands, sinless. The curse is then broken!

Death, then becomes a door instead of a destination! And in heeding His teachings, we avoid the “Second Death” (death of the soul). 

And all this..... without disrupting Free Will. AMAZING!

In even simpler terms? God is not asking us to do something He wouldn’t do Himself. And out of pure love for ALL of us! Amen

I wish I could say you are out of your mind, but I have had to conclude that the only possible explanation here is that you are out of somebody else's mind.

Because obviously you don't have one.

[ronedee]

Looks like you're having loads of fun.  Honestly I don't see why you do it.  Why start a thread like this here?  Not likely anyone will be any more interested than I am to hear your  take on Jesus' mission.  Unlike myself probably half the people here could critique whatever it is you think about the subject if they wanted.  But most people here are not all that interested in religion and come here to get away from it.  You're setting it up for the kind of welcome a JW doorbell ringer would get.  Can't you tell people are annoyed?  Oh well, have fun.  I only post in threads that interest me.

Heya Mark! yup... I'm a gluten for punishment!   

No, it's for the "eyes", not the responses. I well know what I'm gonna get here.
Also, I like to see what the latest bunkum is. You need to wallow in the mud sometimes!

[Minimalist]

Heya Mark! yup... I'm a gluten for punishment!

A gluten for punishment, huh?

Why is that all jesus freaks come across as total fucking shitheads?  Is it a requirement?

[ronedee]

Love is the key factor. And Jesus personifies that Love. 

  


No, Jesus does NOT personify love.  Christianity is the oppoite of love.  It's based on extortion, fear and sadism.  The entirety of Christianity pivots around the idea that everyone is born an unworthy, miserable sinner. The only way Christianity works is if people are throughly brainwashed to believe this nonsense.  Then, when the person is completely convinced they are destined for eternal hell are they given the only antedote to the problem in the form of a Jesus pill.

Christianity isn't based on love, it's based on fear. It is probably the most vile religion invented by man.

The only thing missing in this reply, is stamping of feet, and a reddened prune face.

I would ask why Jesus doesn't mean Love.... but I already know what your answer would be.

What is interesting, and troubling is the number of thumbs up got on this rubbish. Anyone with a
halfa brain would agree that Jesus was about Love. And, no matter what their position is on His existence or not. 

If what you mean is; "religion", specifically Christianity? Then Jesus, Himself would probably agree with you!

Man is not a good representation of God. We were made in God's image. Not the other way around.

Take whatever "pills" you want! I'm not here for the closed-minded.

[Phaedrus]

Love is the key factor. And Jesus personifies that Love. 

  


No, Jesus does NOT personify love.  Christianity is the oppoite of love.  It's based on extortion, fear and sadism.  The entirety of Christianity pivots around the idea that everyone is born an unworthy, miserable sinner. The only way Christianity works is if people are throughly brainwashed to believe this nonsense.  Then, when the person is completely convinced they are destined for eternal hell are they given the only antedote to the problem in the form of a Jesus pill.

Christianity isn't based on love, it's based on fear. It is probably the most vile religion invented by man.

The only thing missing in this reply, is stamping of feet, and a reddened prune face.

I would ask why Jesus doesn't mean Love.... but I already know what your answer would be.

What is interesting, and troubling is the number of thumbs up got on this rubbish. Anyone with a
halfa brain would agree that Jesus was about Love. And, no matter what their position is on His existence or not. 

If what you mean is; "religion", specifically Christianity? Then Jesus, Himself would probably agree with you!

Man is not a good representation of God. We were made in God's image. Not the other way around.

Take whatever "pills" you want! I'm not here for the closed-minded.

The irony being that Jesus does mean love and acceptance, at least his unaltered message. What modern theists pretend is Jesus' message, however.

I haven't seen you represent the same level of Jesus' love, however, @ronedee

If man is not a good representation of god, then why choose man to represent god? Fallible man at that? Are you saying since man is not a good representation of god that we should not trust the words of men who claim to represent god? Seems logical to me.

I am here to open your mind.

[ronedee]

Definitely agree with most of that especially the last bit, although I'm about as spiritual as a brick and I don't believe in any sort of spiritual dimension although I do accept that philosophically where there are gaps in our knowledge there is always a greater than zero percent chance of something being true or possible but just because something is philosophically possible doesn't mean it's plausible or likely, for example I've seen nothing in my nursing career that suggests to me that there is a soul or spirit and quite a lot to suggest there isn't but I can't definitely say there isn't because of those gaps in our knowledge.

Nursing? I have a question for you.... As it relates to spirituality, and personal experience.

When I was in my early twenties, my great-grandma was in a nursing home for several years with severe dementia. Meaning: didn't know any of us family, and was very disoriented.

I used to visit a few time a month and feed her ice cream. During what turned out to be our last visit, she stopped
me, called me by name and asked about her husband who she called by name. She went on to say he had died, which
he had 3 months earlier. She said she would die soon and her relatives would be there to meet her. She also said she
would be there to meet me in my end! After that she went back into her severe dementia state! She died a few days later.

I was taken by surprised and scared at the time. A few of my relatives laughed and even didn't believe me. So, I
never really thought or talked about it much until I became more spiritual. I've read about "moments of clarity", and a lot of them have to do with spiritual experiences. Your take? From a professional pov? Have you heard or experienced anything like this?

This is one of many personal spiritual experiences that I've had over the years. They can be dismissed or explored. And that
seems to be the difference between the believer, and the non. I've come to the conclusion that IF we want answers, we will find them. We just need to be open, and actually ask and look. On the other hand, these experiences can be ignored because there is no physical, or logical explanation for them.

Ultimately, none will convince the hardcore atheist of even a "reason" for God. Which has baffled me. Agnostics seem a better choice than just flat out rebellion. And rebellion is the right portrayal. Just look around.

[ronedee]

The irony being that Jesus does mean love and acceptance, at least his unaltered message. What modern theists pretend is Jesus' message, however.

I haven't seen you represent the same level of Jesus' love, however, @ronedee

If man is not a good representation of god, then why choose man to represent god? Fallible man at that?  Are you saying since man is not a good representation of god that we should not trust the words of men who claim to represent god? Seems logical to me.

I am here to open your mind.

I agree. I am not a good representation. Nor any man, for Jesus!

But, we can collectively come to reasonable Truth! God, said: “This is the new covenant I will make with my people on that day, says the LORD: I will put my laws in their hearts, and I will write them on their minds.”

The difference between right and wrong....that happened upon Jesus' death.

Also, if Love is the bind we all have, then God is there in it also. There was, and is no other reason for our existence! 

No matter what man says, or does it needs to be scrutinized and discerned for: Truth, Peace and Love. That is the litmus test. You can;t go wrong using that prism.

[Phaedrus]

\
I agree. I am not a good representation. Nor any man, for Jesus![/size]

But, we can collectively come to reasonable Truth! God, said: “This is the new covenant I will make with my people on that day, says the LORD: I will put my laws in their hearts, and I will write them on their minds.”

The difference between right and wrong....that happened upon Jesus' death.

Also, if Love is the bind we all have, then God is there in it also. There was, and is no other reason for our existence! 

No matter what man says, or does it needs to be scrutinized and discerned for: Truth, Peace and Love. That is the litmus test. You can;t go wrong using that prism.

Here I am thinking if you were on the side of Jesus, you would find comfort and understanding in the commonality of humanity rather than the differences in unnecessary political nonsense.

[Dancefortwo]

 it relates to spirituality, and personal experience.

Yeah, um.....no. 
Personal experience is the LEAST  reliable of any of the arguments you could possibly bring up.   If you're going with "personal experience" as the litmus test for your god then Hercules and Apollo exists and aliens have snatched people out of their homes, examined them and returned them back to their bedrooms.   Hindu's claim they have "personal experiences" with Vishnu or other gods.  Personal experience is a bunch of hoo-haw.  What you theists need is to demonstrate with direct emperical evidence that your god exists otherwise everything is just a claim.   And by the way, "Look at the pretty trees" is NOT evidence of a god either.  

So it's back to the drawing board for you, my friend.  

[Astreja]

Anyone with a
half a brain would agree that Jesus was about Love.

Ah, that explains it -- You're missing 50% of your cerebral matter.    

We were made in God's image. Not the other way around.

Unsupported assertion:  No evidence for your god.

Also, if Love is the bind we all have, then God is there in it also. There was, and is no other reason for our existence!

Speak for yourself.  I don't need a reason for my existence.  Existence is fine by itself.

[Dancefortwo]

Love is the key factor. And Jesus personifies that Love. 

  


No, Jesus does NOT personify love.  Christianity is the oppoite of love.  It's based on extortion, fear and sadism.  The entirety of Christianity pivots around the idea that everyone is born an unworthy, miserable sinner. The only way Christianity works is if people are throughly brainwashed to believe this nonsense.  Then, when the person is completely convinced they are destined for eternal hell are they given the only antedote to the problem in the form of a Jesus pill.

Christianity isn't based on love, it's based on fear. It is probably the most vile religion invented by man.

The only thing missing in this reply, is stamping of feet, and a reddened prune face.

I would ask why Jesus doesn't mean Love.... but I already know what your answer would be.

What is interesting, and troubling is the number of thumbs up got on this rubbish. Anyone with a
halfa brain would agree that Jesus was about Love. And, no matter what their position is on His existence or not. 

If what you mean is; "religion", specifically Christianity? Then Jesus, Himself would probably agree with you!

Man is not a good representation of God. We were made in God's image. Not the other way around.

Take whatever "pills" you want! I'm not here for the closed-minded.

Yet you haven't demonstrated that Chistianity isn't built on a foundation of hate, loathing  and extortion.  If you don't believe,  love and accept Jesus you'll end up in the East River swimming with the fishes.  The Mafia uses the same tactics.    Christianity is built on the threat of hell and damnation.   Without the threat of hell you have no religion.

[ronedee]

Yet you haven't demonstrated that Chistianity isn't built on a foundation of hate, loathing  and extortion.  If you don't believe,  love and accept Jesus you'll end up in the East River swimming with the fishes.  The Mafia uses the same tactics.    Christianity is built on the threat of hell and damnation.   Without the threat of hell you have no religion.

With the mess you make of my words, based on nothing but hate, lies and ignorance....why not just hurl insults? It would at least, hide your lack of intelligence and real answers to anything talked about.

[Dancefortwo]

Yet you haven't demonstrated that Chistianity isn't built on a foundation of hate, loathing  and extortion.  If you don't believe,  love and accept Jesus you'll end up in the East River swimming with the fishes.  The Mafia uses the same tactics.    Christianity is built on the threat of hell and damnation.   Without the threat of hell you have no religion.

With the mess you make of my words, based on nothing but hate, lies and ignorance....why not just hurl insults? It would at least, hide your lack of intelligence and real answers to anything talked about.

I don't need to hurl insults when you have yet to provide  1) Evidence your god exists and 2) Christianity isn't fear based backed up by threats of hell.

[Bucky Ball]

I agree. I am not a good representation. Nor any man, for Jesus!

But, we can collectively come to reasonable Truth! God, said: “This is the new covenant I will make with my people on that day, says the LORD: I will put my laws in their hearts, and I will write them on their minds.”

The difference between right and wrong....that happened upon Jesus' death.

Also, if Love is the bind we all have, then God is there in it also. There was, and is no other reason for our existence! 

No matter what man says, or does it needs to be scrutinized and discerned for: Truth, Peace and Love. That is the litmus test. You can;t go wrong using that prism.

God never said anything of the sort. Humans (totally only humans) wrote about covenants. There are no gods, and they certainly don't talk. The god (which humans invented) in the OT said his covenant with Israel : Genesis 17:7 "I will establish my covenant as an everlasting covenant between me and you and your descendants after you for the generations to come, to be your God and the God of your descendants after you." .... If there is a new one, it's because the god in the OT was LYING. The gods have put nothing on human hearts and they have written nothing on human minds. Humans are exactly the way they were before Jesus and before any "covenants". You really ought to go get an education about your cult before you start thinking you are competent to go out and (mis)represent it, as you have the doctrines and teachings of the RC Church. You are a heretic.

You can keep this meaningless drivel to yourself ... it doesn't even make sense.
"if Love is the bind we all have, then God is there in it also. There was, and is no other reason for our existence." .... yes there is. We are a species that developed to propagate itself. THAT is the reason for our existence.
"if Love is the bind we all have, then God is there in it also" .... is a classic non-sequitur. That's probably over your head, but nonetheless, it is a logical error.
"The difference between right and wrong....that happened upon Jesus' death." ... another non-sequitur. And it was the will of your god that it happen, and in fact he knew it would happen when he "sent his son" for exactly that purpose. (The liturgy in the Easter Vigil calls the reason for it the "felix culpa" ... the happy fault ... I thought you said you were a Catholic ... apparently a pretty ignorant one). If Jesus' death was evil, then your salvation did not happen. What a dolt. Maybe you could buy a clue ?

[Dancefortwo]

I agree. I am not a good representation. Nor any man, for Jesus!

But, we can collectively come to reasonable Truth! God, said: “This is the new covenant I will make with my people on that day, says the LORD: I will put my laws in their hearts, and I will write them on their minds.”

The difference between right and wrong....that happened upon Jesus' death.

Also, if Love is the bind we all have, then God is there in it also. There was, and is no other reason for our existence! 

No matter what man says, or does it needs to be scrutinized and discerned for: Truth, Peace and Love. That is the litmus test. You can;t go wrong using that prism.

God never said anything of the sort. Humans (totally only humans) wrote about covenants. There are no gods, and they certainly don't talk. The god (which humans invented) in the OT said his covenant with Israel : Genesis 17:7 "I will establish my covenant as an everlasting covenant between me and you and your descendants after you for the generations to come, to be your God and the God of your descendants after you." .... If there is a new one, it's because the god in the OT was LYING. The gods have put nothing on human hearts and they have written nothing on human minds. Humans are exactly the way they were before Jesus and before any "covenants". You really ought to go get an education about your cult before you start thinking you are competent to go out and (mis)represent it, as you have the doctrines and teachings of the RC Church. You are a heretic.

You can keep this meaningless drivel to yourself ... it doesn't even make sense.
"if Love is the bind we all have, then God is there in it also. There was, and is no other reason for our existence." .... yes there is. We are a species that developed to propagate itself. THAT is the reason for our existence.
"if Love is the bind we all have, then God is there in it also" .... is a classic non-sequitur. That's probably over your head, but nonetheless, it is a logical error.
"The difference between right and wrong....that happened upon Jesus' death." ... another non-sequitur. And it was the will of your god that it happen, and in fact he knew it would happen when he "sent his son" for exactly that purpose. (The liturgy in the Easter Vigil calls the reason for it the "felix culpa" ... the happy fault ... I thought you said you were a Catholic ... apparently a pretty ignorant one). If Jesus' death was evil, then your salvation did not happen. What a dolt. Maybe you could buy a clue ?

Hey Bucky, you should tell him about the origin of Yahweh going way back to the pantheon of gods.   Snicker-snicker   

[Astreja]

Yet you haven't demonstrated that Chistianity isn't built on a foundation of hate, loathing  and extortion.  If you don't believe,  love and accept Jesus you'll end up in the East River swimming with the fishes.  The Mafia uses the same tactics.    Christianity is built on the threat of hell and damnation.   Without the threat of hell you have no religion.

With the mess you make of my words, based on nothing but hate, lies and ignorance....why not just hurl insults? It would at least, hide your lack of intelligence and real answers to anything talked about.

So can we assume that you have no good answer for the contradiction of a "loving" god creating a hell, then?

[GenesisNemesis]

Love how they complain about "lack of intelligence" and yet believe a father can be his son simultaneously. Hilarious.

[GenesisNemesis]

Since we're talking about "intelligence" - how is god's decision to create humans intelligent when he doesn't even need to create humans for him to be happy and he could attain happiness instantly?

[TheGentlemanBastard]

Yet you haven't demonstrated that Chistianity isn't built on a foundation of hate, loathing  and extortion.  If you don't believe,  love and accept Jesus you'll end up in the East River swimming with the fishes.  The Mafia uses the same tactics.    Christianity is built on the threat of hell and damnation.   Without the threat of hell you have no religion.

With the mess you make of my words, based on nothing but hate, lies and ignorance....why not just hurl insults? It would at least, hide your lack of intelligence and real answers to anything talked about.

So can we assume that you have no good answer for the contradiction of a "loving" god creating a hell, then?

With all the ducking, dodging, spinning, and twisting, he'd be better of auditioning for Dancing with the Stars than trying to spread his bullshit here.

[brunumb]

I'm a gluten for punishment

 
Gluten is a protein that's found in some grains, such as wheat. It's the gluten in wheat that makes bread dough strong and stretchy.

[TheGentlemanBastard]

I'm a gluten for punishment

 
Gluten is a protein that's found in some grains, such as wheat. It's the gluten in wheat that makes bread dough strong and stretchy.

I think he just likes getting knead-led.

[adey67]

Definitely agree with most of that especially the last bit, although I'm about as spiritual as a brick and I don't believe in any sort of spiritual dimension although I do accept that philosophically where there are gaps in our knowledge there is always a greater than zero percent chance of something being true or possible but just because something is philosophically possible doesn't mean it's plausible or likely, for example I've seen nothing in my nursing career that suggests to me that there is a soul or spirit and quite a lot to suggest there isn't but I can't definitely say there isn't because of those gaps in our knowledge.

Nursing? I have a question for you.... As it relates to spirituality, and personal experience.

When I was in my early twenties, my great-grandma was in a nursing home for several years with severe dementia. Meaning: didn't know any of us family, and was very disoriented.

I used to visit a few time a month and feed her ice cream. During what turned out to be our last visit, she stopped
me, called me by name and asked about her husband who she called by name. She went on to say he had died, which
he had 3 months earlier. She said she would die soon and her relatives would be there to meet her. She also said she
would be there to meet me in my end! After that she went back into her severe dementia state! She died a few days later.

I was taken by surprised and scared at the time. A few of my relatives laughed and even didn't believe me. So, I
never really thought or talked about it much until I became more spiritual. I've read about "moments of clarity", and a lot of them have to do with spiritual experiences. Your take? From a professional pov? Have you heard or experienced anything like this?

This is one of many personal spiritual experiences that I've had over the years. They can be dismissed or explored. And that
seems to be the difference between the believer, and the non. I've come to the conclusion that IF we want answers, we will find them. We just need to be open, and actually ask and look. On the other hand, these experiences can be ignored because there is no physical, or logical explanation for them.

Ultimately, none will convince the hardcore atheist of even a "reason" for God. Which has baffled me. Agnostics seem a better choice than just flat out rebellion. And rebellion is the right portrayal. Just look around.

I have personal experience of my father who had dementia and would occasionally have lucid flashes lasting from a few seconds to a few minutes, these were frightening for him and heartbreaking for the family its quite a common phenomena especially with sufferers of vascular dementia. I have had some pretty freaky experiences around family members and death that I have no explanation for and it would be easy to give these experiences supernatural attributes but the danger there is they may not be warranted, in those circumstances I find the application of occams razor to be the best course of action.

[grympy]

edit

[Minimalist]

my great-grandma was in a nursing home for several years with severe dementia. Meaning: didn't know any of us family

In your case that was probably a psychological defense mechanism of hers.